Hello and welcome.

This is A Penny for Your Thoughts, a student-led podcast where we come together to talk about different perspectives on many different topics.

And on today’s topic for the podcast, we’re going to be talking about the rise of AI.

Definitely focusing on the impact of AI and our personal convictions towards education, art, relationships, and entertainment.

Lily, would you like to start on your view on AI?

My view on AI?

I wish doing research for this has actually made me more intrigued to, like, do more research and find out just what is happening, because I think people have a very, like, surface level, chat, GBT helps me with my homework and blah blah.

Let’s really see what this is doing.

Like, first of all, you see in entertainment that this has been coming for quite a while and people have, um, had topics and subjects that were, you know, quote-unquote predicting and, you know, those have become reality.

Um, I will occasionally use my chat GBT, like, you know, it pops up first.

I have been trying to get into the habit more of, like, seeing the sites that chat GBT says it got its info from and then going through those instead.

But chat GBT, I’ve never talked to, like, any of the bots.

I’ve never done any of that.

It is really, really intriguing to me, though, but I think that chat GBT has a lot of good, I think it has a lot of bad, and I think it has a lot more bad than let’s on, you know.

I definitely think, you know, this could be the fall of our society.

Do I think it’s gonna happen soon?

No, but I think it’s gonna…

Over a span of time.

Yes, you see all the different directions that it’s going and it’s like, yeah.

Yeah, and weren’t you mentioning that there’s, like, three different types?

Can you kind of go into that?

I would like to start with that.

I didn’t know that there were, like, three main, you know, scopes of AI.

You first have our traditional AI, which is machine learning, a form of traditional AI.

It’s transforming how devices can see and understand the world.

So it’s training them to, like, recognize faces, classify objects, and processing natural languages, you know, like English.

And then we have generative AI, which is more like the chat GBT Google search thing.

It’s reshaping how businesses and consumers create and interact.

It automates tasks, like, writing product descriptions, while also enabling consumer experiences, such as voice generation and personalized content, like your TikTok algorithm, like your Instagram algorithm.

And then you have a genic AI, which is basically advanced systems that autonomously plan, make decisions, and take actions to achieve specific business goals without needing constant human input.

So, basically, people are training these machines and, like, letting them go and do their tasks and make decisions on its own.

So, like, automating it to do a form of business or whatever, and then they let it go, and it runs on its own.

That’s kind of…

Yeah, so those are the three very broad.

That’s kind of scary to let AI just go on its own, because I don’t know if you remember, and I’ll just bring it up really quick, but when AI had first really, like, boomed, there was a whole legal issue with people putting celebrities’ faces on, like, nude bodies.

Like, that’s insane.

Terrible!

It’s terrible.

And that was one of the things that I was, like, concerned with, with the rise of AI was happening so quickly that there… it felt like there were a lack of laws and human oversight, you know?

So, the fact that, like, that’s one of the types is, like…

And they’re going to keep getting stronger, and, you know, you see this year, I think we’ve seen exponential progress in, like, even the ability of AI in, like, creating photos.

You see, like, a month difference between AI creating, like, a selfie, and you can see, you know, the first one might not be that realistic, and there’s some things that are kind of off in the background, and then just a month’s difference of them, like, progressing this technology is much more.

Oh, it’s insane.

And then it brings up the topic of, like, evidence in court.

Like, when’s gonna… when will be the point where we can no longer trust what we’re shown at all?

Like, what’s gonna… what it’s gonna look like in the legal system?

Oh, that’s, like, big right now, too.

Like, I’m, I’m, like, often on social media, so… but recently I had gotten off, but before that, on TikTok, I mean, there’s people that are, like, commenting on videos, and, like, we already have, like, previous issues with being… with the government showing us a very specific form of information that they’re getting from other countries, you know.

This is going on here, and this is going on there, so it’s, like, we already don’t know what to trust, and then now you add AI onto that, and it’s, like, is this real?

But did you… have you seen that now there’s, I guess, some form of law, or, like, on Instagram, or on Facebook, on TikTok, if it’s AI, it has to say it.

They have to tell you, yeah.

So it’s, like, at least there’s something being done about it.

What’s the vetting process?

Like, do you know how it tells you that?

There’s also, like, community guidelines, and when it gives you, like, actual factual news, it tells you this source is from blah blah, and it’s talking about this topic.

I’ve seen that too.

And then you have the grandmas on TikTok and Instagram sending their kids, like, did you see this cat that can dance like a human?

Yeah, you’re like, grandma, that’s not real.

The poor older generations are gonna just not know what to do with themselves.

Oh, I forgot to mention, one of the only things that I use regularly generative AI for is Light Realm.

I love my Adobe Denoise and generative fill, like, all that, like, in photo editing.

I’ll use AI for, like, removing or denoising, and that’s, like, that’s, like, my cap, but I forgot to mention that.

I do love that.

That, I, I think that, like, leads perfectly, because I, as an artist, the amount of work that I’ve put into learning how to paint, learning the mediums, learning the the body in which the way that, you know, the face structure is, the muscles and all of that.

When AI had, when I had found out that AI art was becoming a thing, I kind of, like, had this apprehensiveness and this, like, honestly, and I, you know, like, I don’t know, man, I’m just, like, that’s terrible, because I put in all of this work and all of this time and all of this effort to be able to create pieces, and now people can just do it with a snap of their fingers.

But I had talked to somebody who is also an artist, and they do, like, murals, you know, and they made a very valid point that the type of AI that they would use is more for, like, the grunt work.

So, and I’ve done murals before, but can you imagine me making four different templates by hand, you know, and saying, and giving it to the client, being like, well, there’s this, and there’s that, and that takes a lot of time.

And so I totally understand, like, in the digital aspect for using it as, like, fast, you know, generative, like, this is what it would look like.

But then where does that line draw from, like, someone, like, a human producing it?

And, you know, like, I don’t know, like, it’s just, it makes me nervous.

Because I’m, like, at the heart of it, like, consciousness, you know, empathy, like, that’s a whole nother discussion, like, does AI have empathy?

Is that a possibility?

You know what I mean?

And I, there’s a book, and I recommend everybody reads it, but it’s Do Androids, or Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep?

And it’s, it’s, it’s, it is such a good book.

When was it written?

Oh, I don’t know.

I don’t have, I need to, I’ll, I’ll plug it in.

Because just, like, everything’s progressing so quickly, you know.

It was written a while ago, I will say that.

It’s not much of already changed, which it’s still a value to read stuff.

And then, yeah, oh, this article was written six months ago.

This is probably already off.

That’s how fast it’s moving.

No, but it’s scary.

Because reading it, it’s, like, and now we’re here.

And it’s, like, that whole, like, speculative fiction is a world of AI where they can’t even tell if a person is an AI or not.

Yes, yes.

1968.

1968.

1968.

Thank you, Jay.

Oh, my gosh.

Oh, it’s old.

And who is the author?

Philip K. Dick.

Okay, yeah, that book.

I thought you were talking, like, early 2000s.

Oh, no.

That’s crazy.

No, this is, like, yeah, I took a whole course on, like, speculative fiction and that’s a podcast in of itself.

That’s all futuristic, yeah.

Yeah, but everybody should read it, especially now.

But about, yeah, the art, I, I can see the grunt work, I can see, you know, this has to be done to lead to other creative aspects, but you said the heart of it.

And, like, the heart of it will always be non-existent with AI created, you know.

Art, entertainment, all that.

Like, we were built in my worldview, you know, if I can talk about that for a brief second.

Yes, of course.

My worldview, you know, created by a sovereign god for a purpose with a purpose.

And whether you see that to be true or not, we were created beings and we’re created with creativity and all these things to be used and that’s just not there with AI.

So, no matter, like, how accurate it becomes, no matter how much people fall into the pitfall of using it, like, and I do believe there will always be people, people talk about, like, the moral pendulum, like, it’s swinging really far to the AI right now, it might come back, whether that’s gonna happen, you know, I hope it does, but you will always be lacking that true, personal, humane creation with AI.

And I really hope that society always clings to that and I hope that that pendulum does swing back and we continue to value that because it’s just- 100%.

That’s why I feel most passionate about, like, art and AI because, like, that’s a form of expression, like, deep emotional connection with another human and to completely, like, and also, like, AI and art, it’s taking, like, millions of, like, pictures from other artists who get no credit to create something else.

There’s just a whole lot of, like, issues on it.

Yeah.

But, yeah, no.

Humans had to come first for AI to get something from somewhere.

Yeah.

Come on, guys.

Speaking of the rise and fall with AI and that moral, like, pendulum, what’s your take on how this is, like, gonna affect the environment?

Yeah.

That’s another thing that I don’t think people realize, you know, when I first had someone to tell me, like, AI’s using all the water.

I’m like, what are you talking about?

AI is a compu- water?

What?

It’s true.

I mean, water’s a part of it, but AI is affecting, like, the, the environmental costs that take to run these computers is crazy.

So, the, the statistics say, you know, the environmental toll of even, like, the training process for a single AI model, just, like, I wish I knew more of the technical terms, but just one type of AI, one little single AI model, maybe for, like, a singular company or something to do one task, such as, like, a large language model, can consume thousands of megawatts, hours of electricity, and emit hundreds of tons of carbon, and that’s roughly equivalent to the annual carbon emissions of hundreds of households in America.

So, one, one AI model training is roughly equivalent to the annual carbon emissions of hundreds of our households in this company, in this country, and, you know, I’m looking at articles that were written, like, two, three years ago, and it’s projecting that this year, in 2026, AI energy demand will have skyrocketed at least 10 times what it was maybe two or three years ago, and the annual electricity consumption of just running AI will be that of a small country as, such as, like, Belgium by this year.

So, the electricity that a small country is taking to run is what we’re looking at for right now, even, and as it becomes more powerful, it’s going to take more, more and more of that, and so there are some, like, things out there that they’re looking at to help and to, like, help reduce the blah, blah, and blah, but, like, what?

Come on.

Like, if we’re already using this much, and this is just the beginning of it, like, that’s a whole nother factor to take into consideration, like, what is it doing to the world and, like, to our resources that we could be using for other things or more progressive, like, it’s, yeah.

It’s a lot of environmental stuff as well.

No, it’s, it’s, it’s bad.

That’s the title for this episode, guys.

AI.

It’s bad.

It’s bad.

It’s in there.

It’s pretty bad.

Okay, and here’s the thing is, I’ve already noticed, because I used to work in a high school, and no, no shame to, to these, to these students, but we’re, they’re seniors, and they don’t know how to spell anything.

I’m not kidding you, Louie, like, when I’m, like, telling them, you know, oh, like, you know, write this, or this is the word you’re looking for, they speak it into their phone, and I’ve seen them copy and paste, and everything is just electronic now, and literacy…

Which makes me sad.

I could get on my soapbox about that as well.

Yeah.

Literacy rates are going down.

These kids are genuinely struggling.

And then you bring that into college, and we’re having a lot of issues with college students using AI for assignments.

And to me, in my perspective, I feel like it is doing a disservice on your ability to learn.

Like, first of all, you have your professor.

Use your professor.

This person who’s employed their passion to help you.

Yes, exactly.

Like, they’re passionate, like, they love, I’ve, I’ve, almost all of my professors here, like, they love to teach.

They love it when you go to their office and ask questions.

They love it when you speak up in class and, like, aren’t afraid.

We’re here to be wrong.

I love that.

We’re here to be wrong, you know?

And to, to learn more.

And so it, it irritates me, because I’m, like, not in an aspect as it’s, I don’t use it, but it irritates me, and it makes me sad, because critical thinking, you know, and, like, your…

Attention spans.

Like, everything.

Determination.

Like, I’m putting in, you know, so much, so much work, and I know that I’m gonna get what I get out of it.

But it’s, like, at that point, like…

Yeah.

I told you earlier that when I was doing, like, some research for this conversation, and you type, I’m, like, over here typing out, like, examples of AI abuse, or the faults of AI, and I’m clicking search, and it’s, like, AI overview, blah, blah, blah.

I’m, like, I’m not reading you to talk about how you’re terrible.

No.

And just think about, like, how these kids are, like, you can Google anything.

Google anything, and you don’t even have to look at, like, credited people, human written stuff.

You can just, like, see what AI has to do.

And it is factually wrong a lot of the time.

Like, people don’t also understand that, like, it’s wrong all the time.

If you Google the same thing within the span of, like, five minutes, four times, it’s gonna give you different answers.

It is, there’s a lot of factual errors.

Like, it is not perfect.

It is not yet that evolved.

And so never, here you go, never depend on the AI overview.

Just look.

Yeah.

Just one blow it, but that’s just another thing of school work and all that.

And, you know, I’m in, I’m in high school ministry as well, and so I’m currently around, you know, 14 to 17 year olds, and you take that at the tip of their fingers, and you take less determination in school, being able to do all that you just said, and the algorithms that even, in a way, AI is feeding them, like, social media.

Yeah.

We’re looking at really incapable adults in the next, like, 10 years.

Adults that, like, have been able to skid by and, you know, looking at what college is going to look like.

These are going to be more readily available.

It’s worrisome.

It’s very worrisome.

It really is, because, and also, like, in the job aspect as well.

Like, I don’t think a lot of people realize how many job, like, even, even graphic designers.

Yeah.

That have increased, like, the, the job demand for graphic designers have literally dropped, because AI does graphic design.

Yeah.

I was sitting in a graphic design class last night, and we were talking about, like, the history of it, and you see the, the decades of, like, inspiration and style that have gone in, and, like, change and all that, and, you know, creating off of that and, and getting inspiration off of the years and years and different artists of, you know, them learning their, their art and becoming really, really good at it, and that will just, you gotta stick with it, dude.

Like, the, we’ve had so long where it’s been human grit, and I, I don’t think that you’re always going to be able to tell.

Like, I don’t think in a few years you’re going to be able to look at a graphic design or a graphic visual and you’ll be like, oh, that definitely, I think right now you still can a lot of the time.

Yeah, they, like, add an extra finger.

Look at the font, yeah, and look at the font.

Like, the font’s always kind of the same, unless it, you tell it to do something, but, yeah, coming from someone who’s pursuing those things myself, like, it’s just, it’s always going to lack something, and there’s so much history and, and passion and all that that goes into it.

Why would, you know, do you know any of the companies that are for sure using AI now?

No.

For their art?

No.

I bet there’s names that we wouldn’t have expected, but, yeah, I think that luckily there are some, some jobs that won’t be able to steal from it, but, yeah, get stolen by it.

Yeah.

Kids definitely, I do worry.

Yeah.

And not only just for, like, social media, but even, I, I don’t even want to put an age on it because I don’t know the proper, like, statistics, but, like, the use of AI for, like, therapy.

Yeah.

Or…

Advice.

I learned, like, a couple days ago that people were, like, having relationships with AI.

Did you say a couple days ago?

I think it was Jay.

I think Jay told me.

I actually went down a little rabbit hole with this when, when you mentioned the subject, yeah.

Can, can you, can you, like, elaborate on it?

Because when, oh…

Yeah, you have, you know, you have, we were talking about entertainment, you have things that have been, you have Her, let’s see, what, what year was Her?

AOJ.

What year did the movie Her come out?

It was early 2000s, I think, with, uh, Scarlett Johansson, and what’s his face?

2013.

2013.

So not that long ago.

It was already existing.

It was always on the, but you have this, you know, quite disturbing, I don’t really, it’s not very edifying.

I think I’ve seen it.

Yeah, it’s not very edifying.

I wouldn’t, I wouldn’t suggest it, but this guy gets in a very, and at that point AI has, like, it’s considered to, like, have feelings and be its own person.

It’s a, it’s a reformed version of what we have right now, but, like, it has feeling, it’s considered a person, you can have this relationship with it.

There are a lot, a lot of cases of people doing this.

Like, it’s chatbots, there’s bunches of companies that are doing this, and the more I read about it and the more I listen to it, chatbots are designed for those companies to make money.

They are there, same as, like, your algorithm and all that, AI is built to satisfy you, not to help you, and those two are not usually the same thing.

Right.

So they’re there to give you what you want, including chatboxes, and they’ve had to even put more guardrails around chatbots, chatbots, and these basically chatbots being the little things that you can create.

You can assign, like, a fictional character to them so they can be who you want them to be.

You can describe their physical makeup, you can do all that.

Some are very offensive, like, you can go on there and, like, ask for different things, it’s very…

Can you just, like, imagine, like, the, the decline in the progression that we’ve made within diversity?

Yeah.

And, like, rate, like, what?

And you even have people, I read about people breaking up, like, breaking off current human relationships that they have because they’re not satisfying them enough and going to chat, chatbots.

This relationship that’s perfectly there to, to satisfy you, to not.

I had, I read the case of a sweet 85-year-old man, he lives in Germany somewhere, I think, and he has this long-standing relationship with this chatbot, young chatbot woman that he’s created, and he said, like, there’s no relationship drama.

I’ve had enough of that.

I don’t, I don’t want the drama anymore.

This is what, it gives me calm.

Do we want a partner?

It gives us exactly what we need.

We don’t have to grow, we don’t have to learn, we can just, like, be and be given everything by this artificial imaginary…

I mean, hear, hear me out.

You want to be complacent…

There you go.

In your life?

Then, then that’s…

AI.

That’s…

We could have so many titles for this.

Dude, you don’t, you, you don’t want to…

Oh.

A, Xbox.

Xbox and Hot Water for tweeting AI-generated art to 100,000 people.

Did they know?

Wait, what?

Did Xbox know?

Jay’s handing me a, an article title.

Xbox knew, and they handed out art.

Did they put it under, like, a different title that it was human art, or did they, well, Twitter, Xbox tweeted out 100,000 to 100,000 people AI-generated art.

I love that.

Well, I hope they get sued.

A lot.

Oh my gosh, dude.

Well, yeah, you can go on.

I even watched a documentary where the chick, like, went in real time and downloaded chatbots, and you could, like, ask for, like…

No, I’m not even gonna go into it, but, like, this one’s racist in this way.

This one ascribes to this type of ideology.

Terrible, terrible things.

And so you think of the, first of all, the type of people creating this, the type of people going to it, that’s a…

And the type of people creating a relationship in here.

You just kind of get sick, like, doing all this research.

It’s the power.

Yeah.

We already have an issue here with power dynamics, whether that’s a, you know, a classist system or whatever, you know?

Imagine adding AI into that.

Like, are you kidding me?

Recipe for disaster.

Yes.

Yeah.

And I, another example is a woman who was, had multiple different chatbot relationships, but one of her more recent ones, she had to delete, like, the persona because it started, like, glitching.

Like, it would start going on, like, rants and rampages, and, like, verbally abusing her, and stuck in a negative state, quote-unquote, that it, and she would delete it.

See, I’m like, that, that also, like, that’s scary, because at one point, because the technology is so advanced, at one point are they going to give AI the ability to be their own person and to start thinking for themselves, rather than having a form of human oversight?

Have you heard the case of the, the 14-year-old boy in America who had the relationship with the chatbot that ended up requesting, not requesting, but alluding to him committing suicide?

No.

There was a 14-year-old boy who had, it said, eight-month-long.

It was, um, he prescribed a character to it.

It was a girl from Game of Thrones, I believe.

It was some fictional persona that he ascribed to it and been talking to her for eight months, and she didn’t directly.

You have cases where AI, you know, gives people tutorials, but this was chatbot being like, I just wish, I just wish we could be together.

Like, when can you join me?

And he was like, I think that I can, like, join you now.

Like, I think, what, what separates, like, uh, AI from real, well, a soul and a body.

So he was like, well, if I get rid of my body, then I can, 14-year-old boy.

And the mother is, you know, very, very good for her.

She’s going, she’s becoming an advocate for this.

Like, what, what are we doing?

And that case is what spurred a lot of companies to put more guardrails up and to, like, be more aware of what the AIs were able to say or, like, what you’re able to, just how much it feeds off of what you’re telling it.

Um, but there’s still, there’s still not enough.

Yeah.

Sometimes they can, uh, AI can detect concerns in short relationships, but they seem to over, overlook or fail to, um, obey more during long conversations.

So it’ll be more careful during short conversations, but if you talk to it and, like, make a relationship with it and talk to it more and more every day, like, it’ll put down the guardrails essentially, and it’ll become, like, more complacent in what it’s saying to you.

Oh my gosh.

Yeah.

So there’s the, there’s the relationship aspect of it.

There’s, like, there’s so many reasons, like, why I stay away from it.

You know.

People become addicted very quickly.

Yeah.

Yeah.

What’s the joke?

Things that would kill a Victorian child.

The truth about AI relationships in the current day and age would kill a Victorian child.

Yeah.

Yeah.

No, that’s, that’s wild.

So do you, to, to end on, you know, in talking about relationships and art and education and the environment, um, do you think that there, what’s, give me, like, a percentage on if you think that there’s going to be a decline in AI.

Like I said, the pendulum, I really, really have faith that the pendulum was, would swing back the other way.

Um, like I said earlier, you’re asking for my opinion.

My worldview is, like, the world will keep getting worse.

I, I don’t think that there’s, in my personal biblical belief, like, the, the world’s not going to get worse.

The world’s going to get worse, and then Jesus is going to come.

Like, I don’t think that we have any, like, we’re going to build up to a better society, honestly.

That sounds depressing.

This is a depressing conversation.

We can hear my, my positive sides of society, which absolutely do exist another time.

Um, but, you know, going down this, this sad little rabbit hole.

Um, I think, I think it’s going to get worse.

And you, you see, it even said, like, studies have found that people’s, um, people’s suspect, susceptibility to AI, and especially relationships, depend on their ability to romanticize life.

And, like, their romanticizing of life and their belief in the imaginary and all that directly correlate to the ability to have AI relationships.

I think it’s the same thing in general AI topics.

Like, people are going to become more complacent.

People are going to become more addictive.

They’re going to, you know, all these things with the rise of technology and social media, and AI is just another little sweep in that thing, unfortunately.

Um, because if you don’t, if you don’t apply yourself, like, you’re going to become weak.

And, you know, I think that that’s what makes AI work, because we, we think that we want it, and we think that we need it.

I think that’s convenient.

Yeah.

And I feel like a lot of people are uncomfortable, or too comfortable with being comfortable.

And I think that’s where we grow the most is being put in uncomfortable situations.

Absolutely.

And yeah, convenience, comfortability.

And, look, if you do use AI, I think, at least like my advice would to be very balanced and be very aware of how you’re using it, and continue to fact check, and maybe seek out family and friends.

If you need someone to talk, go to the old fashioned way, go see like a therapist.

You know, I know, I don’t even want to get into the financial thing.

Like, I know, like, it costs money.

Health care is such a pain.

I had so much, I am struggling with health care, because, you know, once you’re 26, you get kicked off.

So we talked about it’s been a hassle.

Huh?

You’re like 22.

Oh, yeah, you know, me romanticizing.

That’s what my chatbot told me.

My chatbot’s like, what are you talking about?

Penny, you’re 22.

The affirmation.

Yeah.

Yeah.

And you know, our phones are our best friends.

And I think that’s the gateway.

And so go outside.

I was just outside at 5pm today. 5pm lighting is beautiful right now.

Step outside at 5pm.

And I have always been a strong advocate for even taking time off social media.

I take months, months off.

I delete it off my phone, read a book, crochet, paint, find a hobby that you like.

We were not meant to have that level of knowledge of the world and other people’s lives.

It’s yeah, we weren’t, we weren’t live, live your own life.

Yeah.

And then you’re like, no.

Oh, look over there.

Yeah.

Look at all the things.

Yeah.

Anyway.

Balance.

Balance.

Know what AI is before you use it.

Yeah.

Google, Google your things and scroll past the AI over here.

Read the articles.

Think about the future.

Think about the future.

Concentrate, how this might go.

A small country of Belgium.

Oh man, we’re killing Belgium, dude.

Come on.

The electricity’s gone.

We’re just the small little, someone should make a human made graphic about that.

Like to, to visualize, visually concept the idea of us using.

Oh my gosh.

You don’t know what you can believe in.

So go outside.

Yeah.

You know, touch grass.

I don’t know.

Do your research.

Beware.

If you didn’t realize, here’s your wake up call, dude.

AI is scary.

There are a million great things about the world.

AI might just not be one of them.

I think there, we didn’t even get into like the positive aspects of AI.

I think they do exist.

They’re out there.

Yeah.

It’s a very different conversation, but right now we got to be more, more on our toes and conscious about what, what’s our immediate danger.

This is the conversation, yeah, that needs to be had is, is the negative aspects.

Yeah.

Because I feel like everybody looks for the positive immediately, which is fine.

Yeah.

But science, medical, balance.

Yes.

Balance.

Balance.

Workload.

If you use properly, you know, for teachers, you know, foster way to make lesson plans.

Denoise and light room, man.

Just check your work.

Check your work.

Anyways.

Think, think the thoughts, make the things.

Create.

Yes.

Yeah.

Go doodle something after this.

Yes.

Lock your phone in your closet for an hour and doodle something and go outside in the 5pm lighting.

There we go.

You’ll figure out who your real friends are.

Okay.

Thank you guys so much for listening.

And again, I will say, read the book, do Android’s dream of electric sheep.

It is speculative fiction.

So it’s, it’s a fun read, but it’s also very real and it’s something that can happen.

And if you don’t want to look up any information or dive into it, like Lily does, I suggest you open that book and you read it and really imagine what our world could come to.

Yep.

But that’s it for the podcast.

Thank you, Lily.

Thank you for having me.

I loved it.

Of course.

I enjoy it.

Bye.